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Russian propaganda seen fusing with Republican Ukraine narrative

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prettylight

This seems to need its own thread.

From Fiona Hill's testimony, it seems like the congressional Republicans are not only attacking patriotic American service members (Lieutenant-Colonel Vindman), but flat-out pushing Russian propaganda, that it was Ukraine rather than Russia that meddled with U.S. elections. When, as Ms. Hill said, all the intelligence agencies know it was Russia--and continues to be Russia.

 

What the heck is wrong with them???

This is just the first link I found. If someone complains about MSNBC, there are plenty more links to back it up; Ms. Hill's testimony is all over the internet:

 

Russian propaganda seen fusing with Republican Ukraine narrative

https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow/watch/russian-propaganda-seen-fusing-with-republican-ukraine-narrative-73867845730

Edited by prettylight

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prettylight

Senators were briefed on Russian campaign to blame Ukraine for 2016 election meddling in the fall

In a classified briefing this fall, US intelligence officials told senators and their aides that Russia has engaged in a years-long campaign to shift the blame away from Russia and onto Ukraine for interfering in the 2016 American presidential campaign, according to two US officials. 

That briefing aligns closely with Thursday’s testimony from Fiona Hill, President Trump’s former top Russia expert. The message conveyed by US intelligence officials to lawmakers also takes on new relevance as many of those conspiracy theories have been increasingly repeated by Republican lawmakers. 

Senators were told that the Russian disinformation operation focused on a handful of Ukrainians who openly criticized or sought to damage Trump’s candidacy — efforts that were significantly less organized than the multi-faceted election interference push ordered by Russian President Vladimir Putin, one US official said, confirming details first reported by the New York Times. 

US intelligence officials also told lawmakers that Russia used intelligence operatives to spread now debunked conspiracies, along with established facts, to frame Ukraine for the interference in the 2016 campaign, the official said. 

Russian intelligence officers conveyed that information to prominent Russians and Ukrainians, including oligarchs, to pass along to US political figures and some journalists who likely were unaware of where it came from, according to the same official.

The Office of the Director of National Intelligence, which primarily oversees efforts to counter foreign election interference, declined to comment.

https://www.cnn.com/politics/live-news/impeachment-inquiry-11-22-2019/h_cc82dcd426da9f2c9e79fb6d4eaa60eb?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+rss%2Fcnn_topstories+(RSS%3A+CNN+-+Top+Stories)

Edited by prettylight

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prettylight

Trump's GOP defenders are not merely unpersuadable or merely Trump's enablers. They're his criminal accomplices.

Time for a reset

It’s time to drop the posture that Trump’s defenders can be shamed into accepting what has been unearthed, or that they can be shamed into arguing from a baseline of shared democratic values, or into arguing over how to interpret a comprehensive set of shared facts.

Instead, let’s rhetorically treat Trump’s defenders as his criminal accomplices. Not just as “enablers” of Trump’s corruption but as active participants in it.

Once this is accepted, it becomes obvious why they can’t be “won over,” because they are actively engaged in keeping the corruption in question from getting fully uncovered, in the belief that they, too, benefit from it, and that they, too, lose out if it’s exposed.

The notion that Trump’s defenders can be shamed into facing up to what has happened here is all-pervasive. It includes the have-you-no-shame lectures delivered to Republicans who smeared Lt. Col. Alexander Vindman for supposed dual loyalties.

It includes the oft-expressed idea that Republicans downplaying the evidence are doing so because they fear Trump’s base, as if they would embrace evidence if only they could, as if the problem is missing “courage” and not a more corrupt form of calculated self-interest.

And it includes anguished objections that Attorney General William P. Barr has “politicized” the Justice Department in a way that brings opprobrium upon it.

Meanwhile, on Fox News, Trump just boasted that Barr’s “review” of the origins of the Russia investigation will show a huge “scandal,” that is, show that he was right all along. We’ll soon see about that, but it’s plainly obvious that Barr and those allied with him in this project cannot be shamed into playing this one by facts.

Instead, Barr is using the Justice Department to accomplish precisely the same rewriting of 2016 that drove Trump’s corrupt scheme in the first place — putting Trump’s reelection needs over the findings of our own intelligence services.

The point here isn’t that describing Trump’s defenders in these ways has no truth or utility at all. Surely some might actually feel cowed by Trump voters or feel secret shame in smearing Vindman. Surely shaming smears has worth.

Rather, the point is we need a much more fundamental change in our underlying treatment of the moment. We need to approach it from the premise that Trump’s defenders are not “gettable” because they are accomplices in the whole scheme -- and forthrightly describe what’s happening in kind.

more at

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2019/11/22/trumps-gop-defenders-cannot-be-shamed-its-time-democrats-try-this-instead/

Edited by prettylight

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prettylight

^

“Much excellent work has developed the idea that all this goes much further than conventional political misrepresentation and pushes into a realm of disinformation hermetically sealed off from facts altogether.”

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grieker
On 12/3/2019 at 9:47 AM, prettylight said:

 

thread:

 

I'm sure you realize by now that this is a lie.

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prettylight
18 minutes ago, grieker said:

I'm sure you realize by now that this is a lie.

How so?

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prettylight

The GOP Is the Russian Propaganda Party Now

image.thumb.png.df4fb5acaf77f3012815cddfd4c90ad9.png
ECHOING PUTIN

I’m so old, I remember when the Republican Party proudly stood up against Russian aggression and interference.

During her testimony before Congress last month, former top White House Russia adviser Fiona Hill threw a shocking assertion at Republicans: “Some of you on this committee appear to believe that Russia and its security services did not conduct a campaign against our country and that perhaps Ukraine did,” she said. “This is a fictional narrative perpetrated and propagated by the Russian security services themselves.”

Actually, it wasn’t that shocking. We have become inured to it. What is more, her words fell on deaf ears. 

Since then, one of the GOP’s top Putin water-carriers has been Louisiana Senator John Kennedy, who continues to advance disinformation that matches Russian talking points. 

https://www.thedailybeast.com/the-gop-is-the-russian-propaganda-party-now

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grieker
1 hour ago, prettylight said:

How so?

Trump never said that!

 

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prettylight
6 minutes ago, grieker said:

Trump never said that!

 

all right, let's see what he said:

Trump praises Kennedy after Chuck Todd links senator's Ukraine remarks to Putin

President Trump on Monday praised Sen. John Kennedy (R-La.) for his appearance a day earlier on NBC's "Meet the Press," where anchor Chuck Todd questioned the senator for pushing the unsubstantiated claim that Ukraine meddled in the 2016 election.

"Thank you to Great Republican @SenJohnKennedy for the job he did in representing both the Republican Party and myself against Sleepy Eyes Chuck Todd on Meet the Depressed!" Trump tweeted.

 

 

https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/472602-trump-praises-kennedy-after-chuck-todd-links-senators-ukraine-remarks

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grieker
8 minutes ago, prettylight said:

all right, let's see what he said:

Trump praises Kennedy after Chuck Todd links senator's Ukraine remarks to Putin

President Trump on Monday praised Sen. John Kennedy (R-La.) for his appearance a day earlier on NBC's "Meet the Press," where anchor Chuck Todd questioned the senator for pushing the unsubstantiated claim that Ukraine meddled in the 2016 election.

"Thank you to Great Republican @SenJohnKennedy for the job he did in representing both the Republican Party and myself against Sleepy Eyes Chuck Todd on Meet the Depressed!" Trump tweeted.

 

 

https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/472602-trump-praises-kennedy-after-chuck-todd-links-senators-ukraine-remarks

Your proof of him NOT saying that is clear as well.

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prettylight
3 minutes ago, grieker said:

Your proof of him NOT saying that is clear as well.

not saying the exact words? But I didn't have it in quotation marks.

Kennedy was pushing Russian disinformation, and, after doing so, Trump praised "the job he did representing both the Republican Party and myself."

 

.

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grieker
Just now, prettylight said:

not saying the exact words? But I didn't have it in quotation marks.

Kennedy was pushing Russian disinformation, and, after doing so, Trump praised "the job he did representing both the Republican Party and myself."

 

.

Quotes or not PL, the lyin progressive fake news media machines make up whatever headlines they choose with impunity.

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prettylight

All respect for that headline.

Coming up with the right headlines is a talent I admire--some people are quite gifted at it.

You might be good at it yourself, Grieker.

 

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grieker
11 hours ago, prettylight said:

All respect for that headline.

Coming up with the right headlines is a talent I admire--some people are quite gifted at it.

You might be good at it yourself, Grieker.

 

Lies are easy - truth doesn't sell nor does it fit the lyin progressive fake news media machines agenda.

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prettylight
2 hours ago, grieker said:

Lies are easy - truth doesn't sell nor does it fit the lyin progressive fake news media machines agenda.

As you might imagine, to me it looks like the reverse--the good-faith media struggling to combat the right-wing disinformation machine.

 

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grieker
2 hours ago, prettylight said:

As you might imagine, to me it looks like the reverse--the good-faith media struggling to combat the right-wing disinformation machine.

 

By lying?  Nice PL.

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prettylight
9 minutes ago, grieker said:

By lying?  Nice PL.

Lying = the right-wing disinformation machine

but I would have called it BS, rather than lying

--

was remembering this morning how it took a while--years, maybe--to realize the BS was deliberate, rather than just people being misinformed but earnest.

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grieker
1 minute ago, prettylight said:

Lying = the right-wing disinformation machine

but I would have called it BS, rather than lying

--

was remembering this morning how it took a while--years, maybe--to realize the BS was deliberate, rather than just people being misinformed but earnest.

It's a lie PL,  just like "Nearly 700 thousand will lose food stamps under Trump admin.

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prettylight
12 minutes ago, grieker said:

It's a lie PL,  just like "Nearly 700 thousand will lose food stamps under Trump admin.

I don't believe that, and respectfully stand by my posts.

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prettylight

 

Most Americans don't believe the GOP’s baseless claim that Ukraine meddled in the 2016 presidential elections, according to a new impeachment survey from FiveThirtyEight/Ipsos. Overall, just 30% of respondents think Ukraine interfered, while 71% correctly believe that Russia attacked the '16 elections. "The theory isn’t even resonating broadly among Trump’s supporters: Republicans aren’t any likelier than Democrats to think that Ukraine meddled in 2016," writes FiveThirtyEight. 

But one segment that has latched onto the Ukraine lie invented by Russian President Vladimir Putin and embraced by Donald Trump and GOP lawmakers is frequent Fox News viewers.

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